tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post7835827576827305964..comments2024-01-20T01:42:55.034+05:30Comments on kufr: creamy layer: a figure from the dark ageskuffirhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12137701734913669203noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-87732157352892604422008-04-19T20:25:00.000+05:302008-04-19T20:25:00.000+05:30priya,You merit absolutely no comment :)Kuffir,The...priya,<BR/><BR/>You merit absolutely no comment :)<BR/><BR/>Kuffir,<BR/><BR/>The policies I talked of addresses both caste and deprivation while recognizing that they are to a reasonable extent inter twined.<BR/><BR/>I said, reservations in KVs along with financial help for the reserved category students for tutorial classes so that they would be in a position to compete.<BR/><BR/>And all institutions delivering KV quality is something that is unrelated to recognizing caste. The malaise in educational system runs deep. You can easily see why from Prof Abinandanan's posts at nanopolitan on higher ed. Many of his arguments apply to school level education as well.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-41216601602962027062008-04-19T10:20:00.000+05:302008-04-19T10:20:00.000+05:30Haha, you are reducing the whole thing to quotas l...Haha, you are reducing the whole thing to quotas like only you can:) Population percentage = Job share.<BR/><BR/>So a family should be encouraged to have 15 children because irrespective of whether or not they can total 2 and 2 to 4 they can be assured of jobs because they have numbers on their side :)<BR/><BR/>Isn't it the same anology to the days when rich noblemen could buy more wives at an auction because they had more money, the rights of women be damned, like the rights of the meritorious be damned here :)<BR/><BR/>More begets more :)<BR/><BR/>These backwards have given new meaning to "Science advances on the shoulders of the giants before" :)<BR/><BR/>I am reminded of "Give them an inch, they will ask for a mile". <BR/><BR/>Long live incompetence :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-21990359284177850982008-04-19T01:48:00.000+05:302008-04-19T01:48:00.000+05:30anon,'But have the sense to recognize that at leas...anon,<BR/><BR/>'But have the sense to recognize that at least thus far, these efforts have yielded in negative results so far as OBC community is concerned.'<BR/><BR/>two assumptions: one about sense, which i'd like to ignore because i see nothing impolite about the rest of your comment. two, about the scale of what has been done and the period. <BR/><BR/>and the third, more damaging than the others, assumption: that the lower castes generally don't get the larger picture- that good schools, clean housing and sanitation, healthcare are more important. <BR/><BR/>the problem, from where i am located, is that democracy has failed to deliver those goods, or opportunities, on a universal, equitable basis. and why it has not delivered is because it failed to recognize the very undemocratic core of indian society: caste. <BR/><BR/>caste is a major cause of deprivation in the indian context, because it inhibits the very fundamental driver of all positive change- the individual. the policies you talk about address deprivation, without recognizing caste. if you recognized caste, you'd also recognize that there is no place for such institutions as the kendriya vidyalayas.. all institutions would deliver kv level quality.<BR/><BR/>yes, reservations don't address caste, largely, too.kuffirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12137701734913669203noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-65144054004721976772008-04-19T01:09:00.000+05:302008-04-19T01:09:00.000+05:30kuffir,No change? How many SCs and STs were in a p...kuffir,<BR/><BR/>No change? How many SCs and STs were in a position to get a good education prior to democracy? For that matter did the OBCs have that minuscule 12% or even 5% jobs prior to democracy? <BR/><BR/>How much of caste-based discrimination was there prior to democracy? How many people ASKED you about your caste in a normal conversation then, and how many ask it today? Did you even have a law of the land against caste based discrimination prior to democracy, an excellent provision that exists in the constitution today? How many Indians (GC/SC/ST/OBC) had the confidence to take on global jobs prior to democracy when the country was ruled by British? <BR/><BR/>The society was changing at its own pace, and the pace was slow, very slow. And a number of people decided it was too slow and tried to speed it up. Nothing wrong with that. <BR/><BR/>But have the sense to recognize that at least thus far, these efforts have yielded in negative results so far as OBC community is concerned. I would agree with you a hundred times that something has to be done to improve the lot of the underprivileged. But, if you have a system in place to do that (in this case, supposedly reservations), it is worthwhile reviewing how effective the system has been. If it has been effective, go ahead with it by all means. If it hasnt, well, the least you can do is to review it.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Some_SCSTs_too_made_it_on_merit/rssarticleshow/2256278.cms" REL="nofollow">Here</A> and <A HREF="http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/A_chunk_of_14_general_IIT_students_are_OBCs/rssarticleshow/2256266.cms" REL="nofollow">here</A> are some more facts that are disturbing. The OBCs constituted a mere 18.75% of the IIT JEE test takers, of which 14% made it without reservations. 18.75% is WAY below the even most conservative estimate of the %age of OBC population.<BR/><BR/>14% out of 18.75% indicates to me at least that the OBCs who ARE in a position to take the test did not fare extremely poorly. To me, the problem lies in getting more OBC students to take the test <B>while ensuring facilities for adequate preparation</B><BR/><BR/>IMHO, the government has neglected the sector which had the max potential to boost OBCs, i.e. reservation in good government schools like KVs (and there are 860 of them!!), coupled with financial help for enrolling in tutorial classes. That would reach a lot more OBCs than a 27% reservations in IITs and IIMs. A combination of reservations at good govt schools and higher ed places like IITs and IIMs is what would be even better. And, the best scenario would be if the government had the sense to take steps to ensure better access to higher ed by having more good univs and infra-structure. The last however, wont ever happen in the foreseeable future.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-64520977814368738092008-04-18T21:05:00.000+05:302008-04-18T21:05:00.000+05:30anon,the larger question is: why did introduction...anon,<BR/><BR/>the larger question is: why did introduction of democracy result in no change in indian society?kuffirhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12137701734913669203noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-14756769.post-23687192480231639232008-04-18T18:22:00.000+05:302008-04-18T18:22:00.000+05:30The question that arises then, is why did introduc...The question that arises then, is why did introduction of quotas result in fall of OBC share of jobs.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com